Forum - RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card

#31 | RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card datum

Sat Aug 22, 2015 8:28 pm

@e.v.o
Intel delivers a NVME driver for its 750 NVME device.
I assume Samsung will deliver also a NVME driver for its SM951 NVME version when this one will be marketed (in the coming months ?)
The current SM951 AHCI version seems not delivered with a specific driver.
This is an OEM product and so the Tools for the consumer (such as Magician) are not only 'ready and validate', but are dangerous..

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#32 | RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card datum

Sat Aug 22, 2015 10:47 pm

Zitat von 100PIER im Beitrag #56
@e.v.o
Intel delivers a NVME driver for its 750 NVME device.
I assume Samsung will deliver also a NVME driver for its SM951 NVME version when this one will be marketed (in the coming months ?)
The current SM951 AHCI version seems not delivered with a specific driver.
This is an OEM product and so the Tools for the consumer (such as Magician) are not only 'ready and validate', but are dangerous..

Yeah, cause it's a NVMe driver Intel is shipping. There is no need to so for AHCI ;)
But how does Samsung or the OEMs who put these drives inside there laptops handle the situation? Do they simply put the drive in and hope for the best since it is working but maybe not as fast as it could be? :D

aka Velocet | Xeon E3-1230v3 @ ASUS Z87 Gryphon (mBIOS 3301)|
Samsung 960 Pro NVMe via kryoM.2 evo|ASUS GTX 650 Ti Boost OC

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#33 | RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card datum

Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:36 am (Last edited: Sun Aug 23, 2015 12:37 am)

Zitat von e.v.o im Beitrag #57
But how does Samsung or the OEMs who put these drives inside there laptops handle the situation?

The AHCI variant of Samsung's SM951 is running fine, but there is currently no tool available, which is able to read the S.M.A.R.T. values and to monitor its health.
Warning:
Users of a Samsung SM951 should not even try to get Samsung's SSD tool Magician v4.6 installed! According to my own experience this tool in combination with the SM951 AHCI SSD will induce an immediate and not repairable system freezing.
The remarkable delay of the NVMe variant, which had been announced in April for being available in May, verifies Samsung's current problems.

My current System:
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#34 | RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card datum

Fri Aug 28, 2015 9:57 pm

@Fernando,
Is it the right place where I can post a set of comparative benchmarks about PCIe V3.0 card Intel 750 (NVME mode) 400 GB and SM951 M.2 card (AHCI mode) 512 GB on a ASUS Sabertooth X99/3.1 running W10 x64 ?

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#35 | RE: [Discussion] Samsung SM951 M.2 Card datum

Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:07 pm

Zitat von 100PIER im Beitrag #59
Is it the right place where I can post a set of comparative benchmarks about PCIe V3.0 card Intel 750 (NVME mode) 400 GB and SM951 M.2 card (AHCI mode) 512 GB on a ASUS Sabertooth X99/3.1 running W10 x64 ?

It would be better, if you start a new thread within the same Sub-Forum "Solid State Drives". You can give it a title like "Benchmark comparison of the newest/fastest consumer SSDs".

My current System:
MB: ASRock X570 Pro4, CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600, System Drive: 500 GB Samsung 980 Pro, Graphics: Sapphire Radeon RX570, OS: Win10 x64 Pro
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#36 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Fri Sep 11, 2015 9:24 am (Last edited: Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:59 am)

@Fernando
I have done some tests using a SM951 NVME 512GB (as a secondary media).
I observe very bad performances (half of i750 NVMe, and near half of SM951 AHCI 512GB) !!!
I don't understand why.
Is it due to MS native driver ?
Here are some screen shoots. Comments and suggestions are welcome.
DriverController Infos:

MS NVME driver infos:

Benchs:

I stopped the ASSSD bench due to very slow 4K performance:

Why CURRENT Link Speed not at 8 GB/s ?

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#37 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Fri Sep 11, 2015 12:07 pm

@ 100PIER:

Since I don't have any experience with a Samsung SM951 NVMe, I cannot answer your questions.

My current System:
MB: ASRock X570 Pro4, CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600, System Drive: 500 GB Samsung 980 Pro, Graphics: Sapphire Radeon RX570, OS: Win10 x64 Pro
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#38 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:29 pm

Make sure you turn on Dynamic Storage Accelerator in BIOS, other than that some benchmarks will not be useful with the Samsung nvme drive due to force writes probably, the Intel nvme drive is faster in some ways and slower in other ways but that is due to the fact it has battery backup and has custom drivers from Intel.

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#39 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:13 am (Last edited: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:31 pm)

@mjgr33n
Thanks for your suggestion, but I don't see any 'Dynamic Storage Accelerator' option somewhere in ASUS SabertoothX99 BIOS v1801 menus !

May I ask you to publish your screen shoots of ANVIL and AS SSD benchmarks, so we can compare where is the problem ?

Controller Firmware is "300Q" on my side and it seems very strange that my SM951 NVME device Serial Number is zero.

ASS SSD access time "Write" is 4,222 ms , this is inacceptable compared to 0,028 ms for Intel 750 NVMe device ....

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#40 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:28 am

Zitat von 100PIER im Beitrag #7
Thanks for your suggestion, but I don't see any 'Dynamic Storage Accelerator' option somewhere in ASUS SabertoothX99 BIOS v1801 menus !

Have you looked into the "Storage Controllers" section of the UEFI BIOS?

My current System:
MB: ASRock X570 Pro4, CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600, System Drive: 500 GB Samsung 980 Pro, Graphics: Sapphire Radeon RX570, OS: Win10 x64 Pro
Donation Link:
If you are satisfied with my Forum activities, you can send a donation to my personal PayPal account by clicking onto >this< link.

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#41 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:35 pm

@Fernando,

Yes, I have triple checked all BIOS UEFI advanced menus, and I have not found such or similar option..

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#42 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:42 pm

On my Z97 it's under Advanced - CPU - all the way at the bottom. Just under Boot Performance Mode.

System:
Mainboard: Asus Z97-AR, CPU: QuadCore Intel Core i7-4790K, Disks: Raid 0 2x128 GB Samsung 840 Pro SSD,
Graphics: nVidia GTX 750 Ti, RAM: 2x4G Skill RipjawsX F3-17000CL11-4GBXL, OS: Windows 10 RTM Pro x64

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#43 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:49 pm (Last edited: Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:47 am)

Zitat von 100PIER im Beitrag #39
@mjgr33n
Thanks for your suggestion, but I don't see any 'Dynamic Storage Accelerator' option somewhere in ASUS SabertoothX99 BIOS v1801 menus !
May I ask you to publish your screen shoots of ANVIL and AS SSD benchmarks, so we can compare where is the problem ?
Controller Firmware is "300Q" on my side and it seems very strange that my SM951 NVME device Serial Number is zero.
ASS SSD access time "Write" is 4,222 ms , this is inacceptable compared to 0,028 ms for Intel 750 NVMe device ....

I don't plan on using those benchmarks as they are not real world representative for consumers, CrystalDiskMark is good enough for me which gives good results combined with the fact that my real world use of it is amazing. I am not going to go look for issues when I have none, benchmarks are just a source of paranoia for some people :P

Dynamic Storage Accelerator is in ASUS bios machines it is located near the CSM settings or CPU settings, if for some reason it is not you could disable C-States and set your windows power option to High Performance instead of Balanced.

There are numerous reviews of this drive on the web with them quite clearly stating that due to force writes with nvme drives it causes some issues with writes on some benchmarks due to the way they work, Intel gets around this issue with a custom driver combined with a battery backup on the device which means force writes are not an issue. The reality is you as a consumer will never notice it in real world.

Also make sure you have given the drive at least 10% over provisioning to keep performance optimal.

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#44 | RE: Samsung SM951 NVME MZVPV512HDGL datum

Mon Sep 14, 2015 5:46 pm

In fact the WRITE problem is a known issue published on 1st May 2015 here:
legitreviews article
The current firmware I have tested :"BXW7300Q" is buggy.
This is a conceptual abnomaly that will be fixed in a future combination (firmware+Samsung driver) instead of current MS W10 x64 native driver ...
So, for me it is not true to tell SM951 NVMe model is more performant than SM951 AHCI model.
The truth is this NVMe device is far less mature than Intel 750 NVMe device or SM951 AHCI device.

However, modifying the W10 x64 default values 'Strategies properties' to new values like this will produce more Write 'acceptable' performance:

ASUS Sabertooth X99/USB 3.1, W10 x64 21H2 NVMe i750, BIOS v4101, CPU Intel i7 5930K, 32GB DDR4, Asus GTX 1660TI 6GB DDR6
ASUS PRIME Z390M-Plus W11 x64 21H2 22000.194 NVMe 970 , BIOS v3004, 16GB DDR4, CPUs: Intel i3-8100 (4 cores) +UHD 630, i5-9400F (6 cores) +GTX 980.

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#45 | RE: [Discussion] Performance of the Samsung SM951 M.2 SSDs (AHCI/NVMe) datum

Mon Sep 14, 2015 7:51 pm

@ all Samsung SM951 M.2 SSD users:

Since this thread contained a lot of posts with the topic "How to get the Samsung SM951 bootable" and had nothing to do with the §System Performance" Sub-Forum, I have split this thread and put all BIOS modules related posts into [url=https://www.win-raid.com/t1161f13-RE-Discussion-How-to-get-a-natively-not-supported-Samsung-M-SSD-AHCI-variant-bootable.html]>this new thread.
Furthermore I have integrated the posts regarding the performance of the Samsung SM951 NVMe into this thread and customized the title.

I hope, that this is ok for you.

Regards
Dieter

My current System:
MB: ASRock X570 Pro4, CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600, System Drive: 500 GB Samsung 980 Pro, Graphics: Sapphire Radeon RX570, OS: Win10 x64 Pro
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If you are satisfied with my Forum activities, you can send a donation to my personal PayPal account by clicking onto >this< link.

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